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Re: Reply to HP posting dated 11-14-09 for bios update 5.22 (4823 Views)
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Trillium
Posts: 23
Registered: ‎11-17-2009
Message 1 of 11 (4,851 Views)

Reply to HP posting dated 11-14-09 for bios update 5.22

Yesterday I set aside all day if need be to address the blue screen and freezes I have been having on my one month old 9180 with signifigant upgrades.  I read in another posting yesterday to update the bios. So I went to Hp updates to see if it would update if for me. It found no updates needed. So my suggestion for folks who are not experts at this is to have this bios updated added to the normal automated updated for HP. The reason I saw this is because if didn't go smoothly at all. I just kept at it until it took. I read the instructions which didn't help. The bio updated kept wanting me to use some sort of other burner to burn to my dvd. It wouldn't work. Finally after lots of tries I was able to ask windows to burn it to my E drive and somehow it finally took. I could not read the file on the dvd aftewards to confirm if it took. It said it took so I just left it it and rebooted and it worked. I was a bit put off that the writers of the firmware update obsolved themselves from everything whether it would work or cause problems. Thank god I got back up disks is all I could think of. This doesn't give the customer a whole lot of confidence when reading this and this is what you recommend. 

 

Can't you write updates for your hardward specificially so you know if it will work on your customized units. I don't understand why these is so much iffiness to all of this. You know what motherboards you used right? A bios upgrade such as this is not something the novice can even attempt on their own and especially the way this one is setup so why are you recommending this? Why are you providing an automated update and by pass the novice? At least it would solve a lot of problems magically and quickly and avoid more complaints. I am totally mystified at the way you handle every aspect of all of this. You state in your posting how concerned you are about the many issues that have cropped up on these units. Did anyone ever try them out before they hit the street? It is clear these units were very problematic from day one. I find this whole thing negligent on your part to dump these very problematic units on the consumer and especially with these so called "high performance" models that folks spent much more on expecting a better than average product and ended up with so much less.

 

 I just tried to post a review for my unit and it won't show up. I then had to post to Consumer Reports since folks need to be made aware of the issues they will be up against. You now only show the top 4 best reviews for this unit. So I find that very sleezy way to do business and I am surprised you have stooped so low once again. Also you have now renumbered the same unit to 9280 so that folks won't put the 9180 complaints with the 9280. This is also another way to hide the issues from the public. 

 

 From day one I was disappointed with this transaction. Your sales people told me over and over since I called many times to find out more info before I bought and they all told me to buy before 10-22 since they could not guarantee the price on the Win7 upgrade inferring that the price will go up. I just reshopped my same computer online a month later and it is 10.00 cheaper with Win7. How can folks feel like they can believe anything you tell them when the sales department is groomed to lie to consumers?

 

 Then Fedx delivers this expensive unit to my home without calling to make sure I am here. When I followed the tracking info with Fedx it was not up to date and then I called them and they said it wouldn't be until next week it would arrive and the next day it arrived. I know we got free shipping but at what cost to consumer? Fortunately I was home that day but I could have easily not been. They didn't need a signature for all of it so I could have been out a monitor and printer easily.

 

Then there is no hdmi cord or back up disks. Old legacy  dvi and vga cords were included and they now sit a drawer since who is going to use a vga cord when they have hdmi ports ( with adapter on the computer) on computer and monitor. I don't know whether to feel special or wonder what you were thinking with these extra cords. I hooked up the monitor with dvi cable but for some reason even with driver upgrades it was having problems finding the monitor at times. I ordered a 6' hdmi cord from Monoprice for less than $4.00 a good one so if price is the reason why they don't provide them that is baloney. My computer was customized and why I couldn't just get an hdmi cord without the old legacy stuff is just wasteful. A simple selection at the time of customizing online would have easily allowed for this.  When spending this much for a computer $1700 how much would it have cost to include recovery disks? It cost more to mail them to me after the fact than to just include them in with the computer. Why is basic stuff like recovery disks considered extra?

 

Especially on models like this that have the blue screen of death so frequently. I would have thought it was a necessity considering all the problems these units have. Wake up HP and get a clue that recovery disks used to be included and who ever thought up that there weren't is probably gone from HP by now. Here is an easy way to regain some credibility.

 

 Next the power cord will be extra. How about those automated updates that HP, Vista and Win7 preform? I found them to be useless when it comes to finding drivers for all my upgrades such as my graphics card, sound card, mouse and the list goes on. Why don't these actually check the hardware you have and find the most up to date model specific drivers like they make you think they do? Very disappointing. The novice wouldn't know the difference I suppose until it stops working for some reason. You computers should have a disclosure on them that says these units are only meant for intermediate users in order to configure it properly and to fix the endless issues you will encounter with the bad firmware/software we have included. 

 

 Where is the restart button? You know especially for these elite problematic models they should have at least put a restart button for us since when these units freeze up or with the blue screen of death appears it requires us to pull the plug on these a lot since the power on button doesn't respond.  It would have been a bit more easier if you had provided a better way to deal with all the reboots.

 

So is restart button extra too?  How about all the advise folks are giving about de selecting the energy saving features on the monjtors. One of the reasons I decided to buy a new monitor since my old one worked fine was because of the energy savings they purported. But now that this function is buggy too I have deselected this. The dvi connection worked poorly on the monitor and it wouldn't wake up at times. Someone should tell Energy Star how they got led to believe one thing and it turns out that the firmware for the monitor is defective and causing many to override it and loose the energy savings. Did HP really think we wouldn't notice the monitor doesn't wake up?

 

 Energy Star should have tested the units with the firmware HP planned to supply to verify it before they gave it their blanket certification. False advertising at it's best.  You know on Consumer Reports they listed HP as being one of the highest in consumer satisfaction. That is the reason I focused on HP. I find that to be a sad commentary of what is considered high satisfaction.  I am not one of those high satisfied customers. I have been able to troubleshoot all sorts of issues with this computer so if I was a complete novice I would be overwhelmed by it all. Not to mention the endless hours you they get to have with tech support in India. OMG.

 

 How many years have they been making these box computers? I bought my first one in 1996 and it didn't have problems like this. There really is no excuse why they haven't figured out a way to provide a well built and functioning box computer that works without issues by now or have updates in place that can automatically addreess and fix them effortlessly. This is not rocket science. Can you imagine if we let HP build the space shuttle what a disaster that would be? Is it because you bought Compaq that it all fell apart? Everyone knew to stay away from Compaq and their inbility to write drivers and the endless problems they had and to pair them up with HP was like the odd couple at best.

 

 I have owned several HP printers over the years and remember when I was so dang impressed with their customer service and when I had to have a printer serviced and they sent it to Oregon site and it was top notched. Now they can't seem to do simple stuff they have always done.  I don't know what other company to buy from since it seems like there is a race to the bottom.  Not many folks have $1700 to throw into a new computer and with all these bad reviews many will be re thinking the investment at all. Someone needs to start the race to the top to get those precious few computer dollars out there. Since you won't allow negative reviews to be posted anymore with the 9180 I am guessing this negative posting will also need to be kept from the masses but I will as others have keep trying to get the word out about the major pitfalls of buying a high performance computer from you.

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Intern
Dartan
Posts: 60
Registered: ‎11-13-2009
Message 2 of 11 (4,876 Views)

Re: Reply to HP posting dated 11-14-09 for bios update 5.22

1. What model monitor do you have that "doesn't wake up"?  Sometimes it is the graphics card driver's fault, BIOS, or storage.

2. The restart button is basically holding onto the power button for a few seconds to turn off the system, then turn it back on.  Warm boot (restart) buttons haven't been including on chassis for a while.  At least I don't remember them in the past 15 years.

3. Backup discs are provided if the customer needs them.  When you call support you have that option for them to send it I think.  It's better for the environment in my opinion.

4. Blue screens of death aren't always HP's fault.  I know that I've added stuff onto my computer like Daemon tools which have caused blue screens.

5. I don't know much about HP pricing, but wouldn't the same computer 6 months from now be cheaper?  I remember when I bought my first nVidia 8800GTX graphics card it was $600.  A couple of months later, it was $500, then 400.  Last I remember it was 200-300.

 

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Trillium
Posts: 23
Registered: ‎11-17-2009
Message 3 of 11 (4,838 Views)

Re: Reply to HP posting dated 11-14-09 for bios update 5.22

My monitor is the HP 2159. I installed the correct graphics driver. Yeah it could be the bios fault but whose fault is that then?

 

 Even with the new bios update of 5.22 the blue screen of death appeared so save you time on installing it. The advice from HP is just a stall tactic.

 

 Well I my last computer was a Dell and it was about 9 years old and it has a restart button so I am not sure about where you have been the last 15 years. I also had another computer that was built around the same time for my husband and it also had a starty button. I have volunteered in schools and helped with tech support and many of them also had start buttons so not sure why it is or was a good idea to remove them. I certainly could have used them with this crappy machine. I have held the start button down for a few seconds but when it freezes up the start button doesn't respond.

 

I did call customer support and they charged me 15.00 for the back up disks. They sent them by Fedx. So do you think it would be cheaper to just include them with computer rather than send them by Fedx and charge me 15.00?

 

I have not added much of anything else but very basic stuff onto this computer. I haven't had it long enough to mess it up. I did install the Win7 upgrade. Why is it that my old computers operated better than this one has? I didn't have this problem with my Dell and I updated the bios on that one years ago. I have added the correct drivers, acrobat reader, Office 2007 Ultimate  etc. Nothing to fancy at all. Just the basics no special tools. So are you trying to infer here that thousands of customers here are all putting in the same buggy software that causes so many of these machines to malfuction? That is a stretch. When I first got this machine it was acting up. And no updates helped to resolve it. Even HP is saying that you need a bios update but I did that two days ago and it still is giving off the blue screen of death. Don't you think they needed to test the machine with basic software with their various upgrades before they dumped it on unassuming customers to see if it worked properly? They didn't and from the numbers of postings here it is clear.

 

Why have they stoppped allowing reviews to be posted for the newer version of the 9180. Why do they only allow the top four best reviews to show up? No bad news is good news for sales. Doesn't that smack of a cover up? Many more experienced computer folks have posted here and point their finger at the mobo. At this point after trying to update the software as much as possible I have no reason not to believe them. Something ain't right and at this point you would have thought they would have gotten someone to write some code to fix this but their attempts with 5.22 is not working. They bought these mobo in some third world country and it would appear they didn't make sure the quality of the components and how they were attached were up to the task. Since this has been going on for some time, if I were in charge you better dang well believe I would have found out what was the problem and fixed. Something tells me the mess up is so expensive they are scrambling to find another way to keep this going. Perhaps they are hoping that the warrenty will expire on these if they delay long enough. It is plain negligent. Has anyone thought of a class action suit?

Well I have only had my computer one month and when I was calling HP sales to figure out what upgrades I wanted and it was probably at least a half a dozen calls each one of them pushed the bit where I should buy before 10-22 inferring the price will most probably go up with Win7. The problem I have is that they lied. I wished I had waited to see if HP had the will and the expertise to actually fix the problems. Neither seems to be evident. I realize that the prices drop but HP was warning that the prices were going to spike a whole different senario.

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Intern
Dartan
Posts: 60
Registered: ‎11-13-2009
Message 4 of 11 (4,834 Views)

Re: Reply to HP posting dated 11-14-09 for bios update 5.22

What is the blue screen code?  When it happens you should see a code, something like 0x00000116? 

 

Something like this: http://pcsupport.about.com/od/tipstricks/ht/disautorestart.htm

 

I understand your frustration, but let's see if we can help you figure out your BSOD code :smileyhappy:

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Trillium
Posts: 23
Registered: ‎11-17-2009
Message 5 of 11 (4,827 Views)

Re: Reply to HP posting dated 11-14-09 for bios update 5.22

Your link is about what happens with XP. I had Vista and upgraded to Win7 and with both I got the blue screen of death. What are you talking about?

 

 I am on hold with customer service and I am on hold for supervisor. I guess if you don't return the computer within 21 days they will not refund you your money.  It took days for it to get delivered, then I waited till I got my HP Win7 update to see if buggy Vista was the problem. I technically purchased my computer on 10-4 and now they will not take it back. Really seriously has anyone thought about a class action suit since these bas----- are deliberately not standing by their product much at all. I just got screwed out of $1700.00 for a high end machine that can't seem to load and hold an operating system.

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Intern
Dartan
Posts: 60
Registered: ‎11-13-2009
Message 6 of 11 (4,823 Views)

Re: Reply to HP posting dated 11-14-09 for bios update 5.22

I understand the link is for XP.  Each Windows OS has very similar steps for this process.  The easiest way is pressing Windows key + Pause on your keyboard to get to Control Panel->System, then go to Advanced System Settings->Advanced Tab->Setting and then disable Automatic restart.  Then, you will need to see the blue screen and write down the code (looks like 0x00000116) and respond back on the forums.
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Trillium
Posts: 23
Registered: ‎11-17-2009
Message 7 of 11 (4,800 Views)

Re: Reply to HP posting dated 11-14-09 for bios update 5.22

Yes you would think that those codes would be helpful. But HP tech support is not interested in them here is how my phone call went with them:

 

Since HP will not give me my money back since it has been about 30 days I have to go through their hoops to possible get some satisfaction. No guarantees of what they will do. I have to go to their first level of tech support to get to cash support level of tech support who may or may not give me refund. All very gray response. Even if you say you are not a novice it makes no difference.

I just got off the phone with first level of Tech support in India. It is just what I expected a lot of wasted time. I spent about an hour dealing with them. I have to in order to get to the cash manager level of tech support. Even though I asked for the cash manager since I am not a novice they said I had to go through their steps first. Let me break down how they wasted my time and their money.

He wanted me to shut down my computer. I asked him if he would like the error codes on the last blue screen that the small window still on desk top could provide. No he didn't want the codes. ( I think since it wasn't on his script he had no idea what the codes meant).

1   I turned off my computer.

2   Then he wanted me to unplug my printer, ethernet cable, sound cable, from my computer leaving only my power cord, monitor cord, keyboard and mouse connected to computer.

3   Then unplug my power cord from computer for 5 seconds.

4  Hold down the start button on computer for 5 - 10 seconds to discharge static.

5  Restart the computer

6  Then I had to go on hold for 2-3 minutes while he checked his resources (script).

7  Then he had me shut down the computer again and push PF10 to get to bios.

8  Then he wanted me to select Load Default Setup.

9  Restart computer and then select PF8.

10  Then select Last Known Good Configuration.

11  Restart the computer.

12  Give him another 2 minutes for him to check his resources

13  Now he wants me to find my Vista and Win7 upgrade disks

14  Now he wants to reinstall Vista and Win7 He says his supervisor recommended this.

15 I told him that I would like to talk to his supervisor and I am not going to waste a whole lot more time installing these programs since HP installed Vista and I installed Win7 and it went just fine. I want to know why we need to do this. We have already wasted an hour doing basic stuff that hasn't helped. To have the printer etc not connected at this time and default settings is not a fix at all.  Just busy work. His supervisor didn't come on the phone and I kept pressing to speak to the Cash Manager tech support since I am not a novice and I want someone who can tell what the problem is not someone reading from a script that has no idea what the problem is or how to fix it.

16 He gave me case number and will try to have higher tech support call me back in 30 minutes. It has been an hour and no return call. I will call back when I have more time to waste later today.

 The script they have this poor guys in India to follow is so bogus. He didn't check anything, he didn't look at the codes. I would want to back up files first if it really is necessary to reinstall. But I get nothing from them that tells me they have a clue as to what the issue is. Just a long tedious run around. When I bought this computer on 10-4 I didn't receive it until 10-16 since it took time to build and ship it to me. Then I didn't get the win7 upgrade until 11-7 to see if that resolved issues. So why is 21 days the magic number to return the unit? Most of the time is used up by building it and shipping it. I bet the warranty maybe subject to state laws depending what state you are from. Some state laws enforce stricter warranties.  

 

 

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Tutor
Trillium
Posts: 23
Registered: ‎11-17-2009
Message 8 of 11 (4,792 Views)

Re: Reply to HP posting dated 11-14-09 for bios update 5.22

Since Hp tech support was not interested in the latest blue screen error codes and wanted me to restart me computer I just was able to write down some of the info on the error code screen.  It said it was a 9C error

Then under BCP1 all the spaces for numbers and letters were 0

 There were other lines like BCP2 and BCP3 and BCP4 I think but I didn't have time to write them down and tech support was not interested in them. Also when I asked for supervisor the tech support guy just wanted to wait like 20 minutes to see if the blue screen appears. I told him it doesn't do it on cue. I will be away from my computer and come back after while and there will be the blue screen. I have no idea how long it had been there or what prompted it since I hadn't even been working on it all the windows were closed. There is no rhyme or reason for when it appears or when things freeze up as well. The best they can do is say hey lets wait and see if it reappears? I know these guys in India don't get paid that much but really is this what HP had in mind for tech support?

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Student
benalcazar
Posts: 1
Registered: ‎10-15-2009
Message 9 of 11 (4,783 Views)

Re: Reply to HP posting dated 11-14-09 for bios update 5.22

[ Edited ]

Trillium,

 

Its too late for you anyway, but the 21 day return window begins the day of DELIVERY not the day of purchase. I had a e9180t that had the usual BSOD etc. and called to return it. Good think I had checked HP's return policy on their website which clearly states the 21 days begin at delivery. The Indian rep told me it was too late for a return because it had been over 21 days since purchase. I had to forcefully correct her twice on this before she gave up following this part of her script. Unfortunately for her, the policy is right on HP's website so she had to shut up and move to the next obstacle on her list. Then she put me on hold to "speak to my supervisor" and it was "did you call technical support and get a case number?". I said I had called but didnt have the case number. She said she needed a case number to give me an RMA for my return (lie #2). I refused to call tech support again to have the computer sent back to the shop and be returned to me after the 21 day window, which is of course what they were hoping for. I told her that nowhere in HP's return policy does it say you MUST have a case number to return the system, only that HP has the right to verify that I called. I said I was within the 21 day window and wanted my money back for this lemon period. When this also failed to put me off, she put me on hold again "to talk to my supervisor," who if he even exists, was obvioulsy coaching her on how to deny me the return, but she never came back on the line and eventually my call was dropped back to the main cue and I was greeted by HP's elevator hold music. I called again and got a return authorization number from another rep without problems. Bottom line, if you are within 21 days of delivery and your e9xxx is hanging and freezing, just return it and save yourself the agravation. If they deny you, call back and speak to someone else.

 

Here is a link to the return policy

 

http://www.shopping.hp.com/webapp/shopping/return_exchange.do 

 

Here is the policy, copy/paste:

 

Returns exchanges Return & exchange policy Return periodWe encourage you to try out your products right away so that if there is a problem, you can return them before the returns deadline. We accept returns and exchanges for up to 21 days after delivery, except on opened boxed software, Designjet Z2100 series Printers, HP Color LaserJet CP6015dn Printer, and gift cards (except where required by law). After the 21-day period, you can get support for any product issues from HP Customer Care.

CreditsCredit for returns and exchanges is issued once we confirm receipt of the merchandise. Please be aware that your financial institution may take 5-to-7 business days to process your credit and have it reflect in your account.

Cheers and good luck.

 

 

Message Edited by benalcazar on 11-18-2009 01:29 PM
Message Edited by benalcazar on 11-18-2009 01:31 PM
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Tutor
Trillium
Posts: 23
Registered: ‎11-17-2009
Message 10 of 11 (4,763 Views)

Re: Reply to HP posting dated 11-14-09 for bios update 5.22

Great point to bring up about when the clock begins to tick for warranty. I don't recall ever coming across such an odd warranty time period. If the product is sound I don't see the need for such a short warranty period. I think the only thing that can explain this very odd warranty is they want to cheat their customers if there is a real problem. They have no real intention of standing behind the product. Not even if you spend a lot. I recall when HP meant something like quality and it was a great company to work for. I had a brother in law who had worked there many years ago. They really treated their employees well and the culture was very progressive.
But one thing that is common for such companies is the brain drain that has occurred. I know there is an HP big office near here and they have been laying folks off left and right and it has gotten very cut throat. In many companies where they are cutting back drastically it is not uncommon for the ones still there to not speak up about problems otherwise you will be the target of the next round of layoffs. You are not viewed as a team player. So it creates an atmosphere of dumbing down and not addressing important issues or problems. It is clear that there are serious problems with these units but it's like HP is deaf or so slow to react it really affects any credibility. I feel like I just got a lemon from a used car salesman.
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