HP and Windows 7 from Microsoft

[OldMiller]

Jimmy1One,

Your tone is way too harsh.  Look back at my first post on this thread and you'll see I was making no complaint about HP: I even said they had been helpful considering their advice was not to upgrade to Windows 7.  I had a problem with Win7 and this thread came the closest of many I found while googling for a solution.  Almost all the thread is made up of posts from people angry at HP or the stores that supplied them with HP computers; my plea for help was almost a thread hijack and had nothing to do with the main thrust of peoples' complaints.  I have made no adverse comment at all about HP.

Chaosdivine came out of the blue with a true solution to my problem.  He/she was very helpful, and the revelation of the cause of internet connection problems with Win7, which seem to have affected thousands of users, opens up an amazing insight into the complexity of this operating system.  My only complaint was with Microsoft, whose compatability checker told me my computer was fine for upgrade when in truth it wasn't.  Someone else in this thread already made the comment that Win7 is the most complicated operating system yet.  Oh, hang on... it was someone called Jimmy1One: how 'bout that!  FYI, I purchased a full version of Win7, not an upgrade, and the clear instructions from the manufacturer, which I followed, were to do a clean install. 

The only HP comment from Chaosdivine was that, no matter how good their products may be (and he thinks his HP computer is very good), the massive let down around the promised free upgrades to Win7 would inhibit him from giving HP his business in the future.  That's a very common and reasonable consumer viewpoint: the products may be good but the support is too woeful to justify purchase.

To judge from your unnecessarily vicious and factually inaccurate invective, I'm left worrying there might be problems with your own personal operating system.  Please try to read exactly what people have posted before you weigh in with abuse.

[jimmy1one]

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Chaosdivine wrote:

I myself am miffed at HP for not allowing their Vista drivers to work with Windows 7 directly. Their .EXE's check what OS version you are using (was Vista) and would not work in Windows 7 (gave me errors all the time and would not let me install them). For this reason I will never buy an HP machine again and I will steer any of my friends and collegues away from purchasing HP machines for work, home or pleasure use. For them to cut off support for something as simple as drivers from Vista to 7 is unacceptable. The thing is, once I did a direct Windows 7 upgrade instead of a clean install, all HP drivers work without problem. Clean installs will not let me install the drivers. I've learned my lesson, albeit painfully...if HP would support their customers properly, I'd have nothing but positive things to say about my computer purchase because the machine itself is awesome. It's just this "upgrade" experience and lack of support by HP tainted me for life and I will tell all that I can about my experience to prevent dollars from going in their pockets. 

I should be clear and state that the solution I provided was not my own but was copied from another forum that had the solution. True thanks should go to the original poster but I can not remember his name or the URL of the original thread.

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I'll be happy to contribute more clearly, this is your issue. If you don't like the products talk with your wallet, personally I don't appreciate rants give it a rest. You are going to tell everyone you know big deal, could we get back to the upgrade and leave the vendettas to Hollywood.The upgrade clearly leaves a lot to be desired but it is what it is. You knew that it was going to be an upgrade from the get go. Meanwhlie a lot of you are screaming the sky is falling when the real issue is the fact it is an upgrade. You think you had a problem, you think you have regrets, you feel HP is not supporting you as a customer, form a club.  Just wait until you have to reinstall the OS we'll see who is a blow hard, whinner, or a troll. There are horror stories that make your little glitch a joke, welcome to the real world. Go back and take a look at what they sent you in the kits. I've already stated I'm going to have to buy a MS license for Windows 7 rather than risk a complete rollback to Vista 64 "WHEN" I have to replace a HDD or reinstall the OS. I equated Upgrade with a full license, it was my mistake it's not like HP did not clearly say Upgrade to Windows 7. The issue is not support it's the way the upgrade program itself is being implemented. Are we going to be able to have an actual Windows 7 license instead of the Upgrade license without a box copy of Windows 7? I have not seen a definitive answer, it seems no one wants to address the issue directly. The point is you can not reinstall Windows 7 directly with an Upgrade disk you're gong to find the real issue is the roll back to reinstall.

[mgerdee]

Microsoft and HP have these upgrade programs because they see drastic drop offs in PC purchases in the year before a new OS release.  People put off the purchase of PC's until the new OS comes out.  These programs are supposed to mitigate that.  It is in their best interest for them to be successful in order to smooth out the dip and avoid a bad year before every OS release.

But, they are ruining their own plan by not caring enough to make the program successful, or trying to do it on the cheap.  When consumers stop trusting these upgrade offers.....and they are starting to distrust these upgrade offers.  Then the program will not be effective and the parties ultimately harmed by that fact will be HP and Microsoft.

After this experience, I would always recommend to any of my friends that they DO NOT purchase PC's in the year before an OS release and DO NOT trust OS upgrade offers....especially from HP.

[jimmy1one]

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mgerdee wrote:

Microsoft and HP have these upgrade programs because they see drastic drop offs in PC purchases in the year before a new OS release.  People put off the purchase of PC's until the new OS comes out.  These programs are supposed to mitigate that.  It is in their best interest for them to be successful in order to smooth out the dip and avoid a bad year before every OS release.

But, they are ruining their own plan by not caring enough to make the program successful, or trying to do it on the cheap.  When consumers stop trusting these upgrade offers.....and they are starting to distrust these upgrade offers.  Then the program will not be effective and the parties ultimately harmed by that fact will be HP and Microsoft.

After this experience, I would always recommend to any of my friends that they DO NOT purchase PC's in the year before an OS release and DO NOT trust OS upgrade offers....especially from HP.

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mgerdee

You know you're right, I just don't believe it's just HP and MS. I 've already made the decision , purchased and upgraded. I need an answer to the licensing issue. I'm not a kid I've taken reasoable precautions but the only way to be sure is to have a hard copy of Windows 7 not an upgrade license of the OS. HDD fail it a matter of time, DVD's and CD's have acceptable error rates so they may fail during an reinstall. I've never had a OS manufactures OS disk fail since 3.1. Again my question is why they would go throuh all of this ? Telling us what files we needed to delete, sending us the Windows DVD then have us upgrade the HP software from the HP site would have been simplier?  I realize the HP drivers have to install before Windows 7 is allowed to complete. I just don't get all the hoops we are asked to jump through then be forced to roll back to Vista 64 when we have to reinstall the OS.

jimmy

[Vis_Viva]

Just checking but am I correct in assuming there is no download page for the upgrade yet? I purchased a refurbished HP Pavilion (model m9500y) desktop after my old PC's operating system was corrupted. I COULD have just re-installed that, and I did try MANY ways to repair it, but I had been planning a major hardware upgrade anyway, so the idea of doing a complete re-install was not something I was looking forward to. The only point here that is important is that I wanted to AVOID days of work just to REDO it soon after

I purchased the HP Pavilion (model m9500y) from Microcenter and was informed I could DOWNLOAD an upgrade to Windows 7. I now see that there IS no download and I have to wait for my receipt to be validated then a disk to be mailed to me. I don't want to seem impatient but part of my main issue is that I have several peripherals to add and DAYS of software to re-install. I wasn't even going to BOTHER to do so with Vista and wanted to upgrade the machine RIGHT AWAY before doing any of that. So now I have to decide if I want to install the world on this before I get the upgrade, then upgrade, and then run the risk of having to RE-install the world, or sit on my hands until the upgrade is mailed to me.

Not having a ready upgrade option would have probably been a deal-breaker for this particular model. I would have just built a unit from scratch and had Windows 7 added on.

[mgerdee]

Yep, and the validation process is neither speedy nor pain free in my experience.  I started the process a month ago and am still waiting.  It is apparently a lot harder to mail out CD's than one would imagine.

[Vis_Viva]

Well that leaves me in a but of a conundrum. Do I install the "world" on the machine in Vista-mode, then upgrade to 7 on top of i?  I generally do clean installs with OS upgrades, but that would mean I either wait for a few weeks to set up my main PC, or I plan to RE-install the world in a couple of weeks. Since all my data files are on a separate HD, and the registry will be "fairly" clean with only my necessary programs and active peripherals installed and not a year or two of JUNK in it, I will try to upgrade this time. Worst case scenario is that it doesn't work, I need to do a clean install, and my data is safe on the other HD, and I have to re-install the programs and peripherals. 

I will be calling Microcenter to complain about the “download” comments they made. I usually build my own PC’s this was a good deal for the price however, and seemed like it would be less work.  If I have to install the world on this TWICE that would be as tough as building it, then installing everything once.

[Boss_Hogg_Ky]

Vis_Viva, all I can offer is my own experience. I have a HP Touchsmart IQ506 I purchased about a year ago with Vista 64. When Win 7 came out I downloaded the RC and tried it out and was sufficiently impressed. It was much more stable than Vista and faster too. So, I ordered an upgrade version from Microsoft and received it shortly after it was released on October 22. I opted to perform an "upgrade in place" so I wouldn't have to re-install the HP drivers. It took quite a while for the automatic update to complete (about 3 hours), but everything worked just fine when it completed. The only issue was Win 7's Aero wasn't functionaing correctly, but that was resolved by downloading the Vista-64 driver update and installing it. I've been using Win 7 now for about 5 weeks and am very pleased.

[jimmy1one]

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Vis_Viva wrote:
Well that leaves me in a but of a conundrum. Do I install the "world" on the machine in Vista-mode, then upgrade to 7 on top of i?  I generally do clean installs with OS upgrades, but that would mean I either wait for a few weeks to set up my main PC, or I plan to RE-install the world in a couple of weeks. Since all my data files are on a separate HD, and the registry will be "fairly" clean with only my necessary programs and active peripherals installed and not a year or two of JUNK in it, I will try to upgrade this time. Worst case scenario is that it doesn't work, I need to do a clean install, and my data is safe on the other HD, and I have to re-install the programs and peripherals. 

I will be calling Microcenter to complain about the “download” comments they made. I usually build my own PC’s this was a good deal for the price however, and seemed like it would be less work.  If I have to install the world on this TWICE that would be as tough as building it, then installing everything once.

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Vis_Viva

Vista must be installed on your machine in order to use the HP Windows 7 Upgrade kit. The reason is Windows 7 looks for a license to begin the upgrade process, without Vista being present you can not install the upgrade. I've completed the upgrade on two computers with few issues. All the issues I had have been solved by HP updates to the Windows 7 support and driver site. Be sure to delete the programs you are asked to delete. Don't worry they are going to tell you what to delete and ask you to verify you have completed the deletions.

You know what you are doing but I'd advise not doing the clean install strictly a time and safty issue for me. Just follow the instructions on the sheet and pay close attention to section 3 when you are instructed to disconnect from the net. The HP drivers must be installed before Windows 7 is allowed to finish its installation process. The instruction will tell when to disconnect and then reconnect to the net. If you do not disconnect from the net as requested you are going to have driver issues. Other than that all the problems with HP Support Assistant and HP Update have been corrected. After you finish check out the support and driver Windows 7 section to make sure you have the latest versions of the software. Good luck

jimmy

[Still_Vis_Viva]

Sorry about the name change. For some reason the log-in made me pick a new alias.

 

Actually most MS OS upgrades DO have historically contained the entire program and you CAN do a fresh install you just are called upon to put a copy of the previous OS install disk in at some point to "prove" you are upgrading. I’ve done this numerous times otherwise every time I’ve rebuilt a PC I would have had to start with a Windows 3.11 floppy disk. I don’t tend to build a new PC and get a new OS at the same time. As a matter of fact this is the 1st machine that is not an upgrade of something of a previous machine (the machine I just replaced still had the floppy drive from my 1992 486DX66). I always have done “fresh” installs even though every single install I’ve ever done has been an upgrade .

 

HP should be happy they are the 1st manufacture to get me to make a “fresh start” since I graduated from college. Ironically I bought it from the same chain that my 1992 machine was from.

 

I am going to go ahead, and set up my machine w/ the installed Vista first (kind of feel tricked into using Vista for a few weeks though) and then just do the upgrade on top of the set-up machine. I’m hoping not having a year of junk in the registry will help keep it stable. Sounds like I just have to be REALLY REALLY careful to follow instructions. I will try to use just the right balance of beer and/or coffee to keep me awake yet relaxed.

 

Thanks for the feedback. I will let people know how well it goes.

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jimmy1one wrote:

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Vis_Viva wrote:
Well that leaves me in a but of a conundrum. Do I install the "world" on the machine in Vista-mode, then upgrade to 7 on top of i?  I generally do clean installs with OS upgrades, but that would mean I either wait for a few weeks to set up my main PC, or I plan to RE-install the world in a couple of weeks. Since all my data files are on a separate HD, and the registry will be "fairly" clean with only my necessary programs and active peripherals installed and not a year or two of JUNK in it, I will try to upgrade this time. Worst case scenario is that it doesn't work, I need to do a clean install, and my data is safe on the other HD, and I have to re-install the programs and peripherals. 

I will be calling Microcenter to complain about the “download” comments they made. I usually build my own PC’s this was a good deal for the price however, and seemed like it would be less work.  If I have to install the world on this TWICE that would be as tough as building it, then installing everything once.

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Vis_Viva

Vista must be installed on your machine in order to use the HP Windows 7 Upgrade kit. The reason is Windows 7 looks for a license to begin the upgrade process, without Vista being present you can not install the upgrade. I've completed the upgrade on two computers with few issues. All the issues I had have been solved by HP updates to the Windows 7 support and driver site. Be sure to delete the programs you are asked to delete. Don't worry they are going to tell you what to delete and ask you to verify you have completed the deletions.

You know what you are doing but I'd advise not doing the clean install strictly a time and safty issue for me. Just follow the instructions on the sheet and pay close attention to section 3 when you are instructed to disconnect from the net. The HP drivers must be installed before Windows 7 is allowed to finish its installation process. The instruction will tell when to disconnect and then reconnect to the net. If you do not disconnect from the net as requested you are going to have driver issues. Other than that all the problems with HP Support Assistant and HP Update have been corrected. After you finish check out the support and driver Windows 7 section to make sure you have the latest versions of the software. Good luck

jimmy

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jimmy1one wrote:

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Vis_Viva wrote:
Well that leaves me in a but of a conundrum. Do I install the "world" on the machine in Vista-mode, then upgrade to 7 on top of i?  I generally do clean installs with OS upgrades, but that would mean I either wait for a few weeks to set up my main PC, or I plan to RE-install the world in a couple of weeks. Since all my data files are on a separate HD, and the registry will be "fairly" clean with only my necessary programs and active peripherals installed and not a year or two of JUNK in it, I will try to upgrade this time. Worst case scenario is that it doesn't work, I need to do a clean install, and my data is safe on the other HD, and I have to re-install the programs and peripherals. 

I will be calling Microcenter to complain about the “download” comments they made. I usually build my own PC’s this was a good deal for the price however, and seemed like it would be less work.  If I have to install the world on this TWICE that would be as tough as building it, then installing everything once.

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Vis_Viva

Vista must be installed on your machine in order to use the HP Windows 7 Upgrade kit. The reason is Windows 7 looks for a license to begin the upgrade process, without Vista being present you can not install the upgrade. I've completed the upgrade on two computers with few issues. All the issues I had have been solved by HP updates to the Windows 7 support and driver site. Be sure to delete the programs you are asked to delete. Don't worry they are going to tell you what to delete and ask you to verify you have completed the deletions.

You know what you are doing but I'd advise not doing the clean install strictly a time and safty issue for me. Just follow the instructions on the sheet and pay close attention to section 3 when you are instructed to disconnect from the net. The HP drivers must be installed before Windows 7 is allowed to finish its installation process. The instruction will tell when to disconnect and then reconnect to the net. If you do not disconnect from the net as requested you are going to have driver issues. Other than that all the problems with HP Support Assistant and HP Update have been corrected. After you finish check out the support and driver Windows 7 section to make sure you have the latest versions of the software. Good luck

jimmy

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