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01-24-2021 07:35 AM
After receiving the forced BIOS update F.21, my machine is now overheating. On a restart the CPU temperature can be 92 degrees and the fan runs at full speed to cool it back down. A cold boot is okay.
I have had a number of crashes with the temperature reaching 95 degrees, if I start to push the unit, such as playing a game. It is only the CPU that is overheating, the GPU is fine. It completely locks up and can have overheating warnings on bootup.
All fan diagnostic tests pass and as previously stated it is only since the forced firmware upgrade.
I have tried to rollback, but it won't let me (thanks HP), the only previous version to download is F20. I think I was on F.15 before the forced update in Windows 10.
Does anybody know of a way to get around the issue of not being able to rollback to a previous firmware? Really annoying, as the machine was working perfectly, before they screwed it up!
01-28-2021 04:09 PM
The notes don't indicate that it cannot be rolled back, but that doesn't mean it can either.
It may or may not roll back if you try to do it via a USB pen drive, but no guarantees. https://support.hp.com/us-en/document/c04126730
Problem is when you mess around with trying to do that, you run the risk of something failing in the process. The result is turning your PC into a giant paper weight if that happens.
I would contact HP Warranty and complain of the issue. They can at least have it on record if others are experiencing the same problem. A bios update would be needed. Contact HP Worldwide | HP® Official Site
With that said:
I can offer a work around in the mean time if you are interested. Its just a suggestion...
- Try running Intel's XTU software and undervolt the CPU. This will reduce the temps. Performance will take maybe a slight hit, but at least you aren't crashing from overheating. There are lots of tutorials on the web on how to use it.
- For safety... create a restore point before tweaking. Even better and you should already be doing this, create a system image of your drive to an external drive first. Free tools like AOMEI Backupper or Macrium do a great job of this.
01-28-2021 04:50 PM
Thanks for your reply,
I have already tried every possibility I know of to roll back the firmware, including using a USB image at the boot up menu (you described). Another method I was told about, was the secret Windows B & Power, which was suppose to rollback to the original firmware the machine came with. However, it just put F.21 back on, there seems no way of getting rid of this rotten firmware, except replacing the motherboard. Which is now, what they are going to do.
I have since discovered if I play a game that is not too taxing, and I assign it to use only the CPU graphics processor, then the CPU does not overheat. It seems to be tied in to GPU and the CPU somehow. You would think that with the GPU doing all the work the CPU would have no possibility of overheating.
It seems amazing to me; one has to replace hardware for a software fault. But then again given that it has crashed a number of times with overheating, maybe it has reduced the life of some of the components.
01-28-2021 05:02 PM
Glad they are working with you to resolve the issue. Yes basically HP does the work internally when it comes to bios chip replacement for various reasons. Usually its just easier to replace the motherboard or whole PC in such case, which ever option is available at the time. In the future, turn off auto updates in the HP Support Assistant. Although I am assuming your bios update came through a Windows update. 😠
Did it harm the life of the CPU, I highly doubt it. It shuts off to prevent damage (the crashes) and I dont think you had enough instances to make a difference.
Anyways, good luck and stay safe. 🙂
01-28-2021 05:48 PM
Thanks again for your information.
Yes, I already had updates turned off in HP Support Assistant (Only notify).
What I did not know was a BIOS firmware update could come through Windows update process. This has never happened to me before.
I have now disabled that (buried) option in Windows 10. For those that don’t know about it. You can change it in Settings->System->About->Advanced System Settings->Hardware and then Driver Installation Options (Turn Off Manufacture updates).
I really think HP should change its policy of sending Firmware updates through this method.
01-28-2021 05:57 PM
I forgot to mention, I also found this information on a previous firmware update F.12
It sounds very similar, like they have introduced the issue back in to F.21
Version: F.12 Rev.A
Fixed in this release: - Fixes issue where the system hangs or freezes when playing games or the CPU load transitions from idling to a heavy workload. The unit will shut down automatically if it hangs for about ten minutes. Also, a 90D error may occur on the first restart after the unit shuts down indicating a possible overheat scenario.
02-01-2021 09:13 PM
Well, I cannot believe what just happened, I am right back where I started.
The technician arrived today with the new motherboard. Spent 45 minutes just to remove the back from the computer, because it uses a special tape to hold the back on.
It is a fiddly time consumer job, especially if you don’t want to damage anything in the process. Six layers of tape have to be removed by pulling from the ends once corners are pried open. You need to be very careful if the tape breaks while doing it, you will spend a lot more time in trying to remove it without damaging the back.
After that, it is a straight forward job, it takes less time to do the actual work than it does messing around with the back panel of the computer. What bright spark came up with this idea?
Everything appeared to go well, the BIOS version stated on the motherboard was F.13. I thought great that solves that problem. He had to enter the old serial number back into the BIOS, via a special USB program.
Then the fun started, on boot up, I came up straight away that it needed to update the BIOS. We escaped out of it and booted in to Windows everything seemed fine. The temperatures were normal again, but the new serial number was not showing up.
After a few goes we decided that it must need to update something regarding the serial number, as it would try and update the BIOS on every single boot up.
Given that it was not connected to the internet, it seemed the only cause of action.
It does not give you any information regarding the BIOS firmware it wants to install, just that it has to do it. Unbelievable it put F.21 back on without any indication it was doing so. Apparently, it is stored on the SSD drive somewhere and looks for it at bootup. So not being connected to the internet made no difference at all.
They have got to be kidding, no information on what is happening and forcing procedures on users that stuff up their computers.
It is so frustrating; I am now in the process of trying to organize a new computer. I have wasted some much time on this and will have to setup everything again from scratch. Would not be game to restore from backup, given HP’s lack of choices, information and no regression path. If I restored from backup, I would be in the same scenario with it putting on F.21 firmware again, all because of bad restrictive policies.
The trouble is I am in Australia, which really is only a HP hub, this information needs to get back to people who are making these poor decisions!!!
02-01-2021 10:31 PM
The technician is trying to raise it through his channels, and said he would get back to me.
Meanwhile I have gone back to HP support and explained what has happened, they are supposed to be organizing a new PC, if one is available. I will not be happy if they try and palm off a refurbished model after all this palaver.
It is still the latest model offered on HP website, so new ones should be available.
I wish I new where they have planted the firmware on the SSD drive, because it would save me heaps of time, if I could restore back everything to a new PC. I am still in disbelief that it checks for it at bootup.
I guess I am cursed with this F.21 firmware! I have never had these issues with Dell, so HP needs to win me over somehow. I am not use to having my hands tied behind my back, there usually is a way around a problem, but HP has blocked all avenues. Apart from using a hex editor to modify the header on F.20 to fool HP into thinking it is F.21. But I don’t want to go down that path and risk bricking the machine.
02-12-2021 05:16 AM
Update on my saga with HP’s faulty F.21 firmware It is not going well with HP, so far they have offered me an older lower spec replacement PC (total swap out).
All this wasted time and they want to replace it with an older machine (probably refurbished) for all the pain they have caused me.
I only purchased it because of the high-end specs, why would they even consider offering me a machine worth less than half the price. They claim they are no longer selling this high-end model, but I see it is available in the US.
I have noticed they have removed the faulty F.21 firmware from HP’s support site, but this does not do me any good. The support people here have no idea what is going on, they seem to be left in the dark. So, I have no idea of any timeline and what HP technical backend people are doing about it.
They now only have F.20 available for download (but too late if you already have F.21 installed). I previously thought I had F.20 (before F.21), but looking back through my logs, it shows the previous version I had was F.13, so I have no idea about F.20.
Not impressed, with the support I have received from HP. This sort of issue is completely out of their league for a small support hub. I am still in disbelief that all this has happened from one of the largest computer companies in the world and no information is being passed on to their customers.