Upgrading Memory

[highlander216]

Hi!

Thank you for responce. I used Corsair memory finder to find correct memory to my pc. Corsair memory finder shows that supported memory for Hewlett-Packard 8000 Elite Convertible Minitower is:
Vengeance® Low Profile — 16GB Dual/Quad Channel DDR3 Memory Kit (CML16GX3M4A1600C9)

So I ordered this memory, but also this memory was giving the same error (led flashing during startup). I haven`t send question to their tech support yet.

My HP 8000 elite Product No.WB716ET#UUW (S/N:CZC0057TF8)

[Woodwood]

->Highlander216

Thank you for that post.  It seems thar PC is an ultra slim desk top variety - USDT

Do speak to Corsair tech support, I think they guarantee memory to be compatible, so in the worst case you would get a refund.

I have spoken to Crucial (US) and they recommend calling the UK office as the part you have is an EU part (you are in the EU ?).  The number is...have lost it but it was an 0800 number (I expected an email of conversation with the number in it you could try Freephone: 0800 013 0330 International: +44 (0)1355 586 100 Hours (GMT): Monday-Friday: 7:30am-7:30pm (GMT) - apparently thy hold compatibility lists for EU parts)

I have also looked in the service manual

http://h20628.www2.hp.com/km-ext/kmcsdirect/emr_na-c01941953-2.pdf

and found in appendix C (p.189) a list of of POST error messages which you might like to check (remember to turn POST error messages on, default is off, as described at the start of appendix C)

Next I wentto the index and looked at memory, starting on p39, where it confirms that your system is capable of working with 16GB RAM.  I started reading that, and one thing I noticed was that your system cannot support x4 SDRAMs, and some other limitations as well.  Although Crucial US say [with the caveat that I couldn't find the exact PC you have] 1600 MHz RAM is compatible, the HP documentation says to use only 10667 MHz or 1333 MHz RAM (with  some more detail).  I didn't go beyond thaat point, nor check the other refs to memory in the index or the other documents.   Please read all this bacause it might well give you the solution to your problem.

I would take a copy of all the documents HP made available for your system because HP might remove them from their website at any time.

Woodwood

13.January.2014

[highlander216]

-> Woodwood

Thank you for your responce, ideas and service manual.

Yes, I am from EU.

When I insert new RAM in to slot (I tested all new memories also so that I insert one RAM module into first socket) and start pc then power LED flashes 5 times. According to manual, it shows that 5 led flashes is: Pre-video memory error.

I don`t understand why this message appears with new memory. I don`t use onboard video card, there is additional video card in PCIe port which I use.

I will check Post Error messages later today.

For some pc-s it is possible to change RAM parameters in BIOS, but for this PC BIOS has very limited parameters what you can change.

[highlander216]

I enabled Post Error messages, but I can`t see any error message. When I turn on pc (with new memory inserted) right away I get flashing led (five times and audio signal) and I there is no post error message on screen (display is not turning itself on also). It seem`s that I just can`t upgrade my RAM.

[Woodwood]

-> Highlander216

For your reference the HP  document concerning replacement memory is here

http://h20566.www2.hp.com/portal/site/hpsc/template.PAGE/public/kb/docDisplay/?spf_p.tpst=kbDocDispl...

my last and long post seems to have gone astray.

I was incorrect in saying you must have the USDT variant.

I found your model on the Kingston and Crucial memory finders and the recommended memory for your PC is not what you have.

For the Crucial

http://www.crucial.com/store/listparts.aspx?model=HP%20Compaq%208000%20Elite%20Convertible%20Minitow...

For the Kingston

http://www.kingston.com/en/memory/search?DeviceType=2&Mfr=HEW&Line=Elite&Model=59296&Description=Kin...

This does not mean to say the memory you have will not work in your PC.  Note that Kingston recommended memory is DDR3-1333MHz.

As I recommended, you should discuss this problem with Corsair at least, I recommend trying them in the first instance because you have their recomended memory (apart from the letter 'B' at the end of the memory you have - teir recommndation is for a complete 16GB kit).

Just to confirm, you did try one DIMM only in the compulsory slot (black) ?  I think you did but I am checking.  Did you also try with just one of the Samsung modules ?  And if I am correct, your computer boots with the Samsung module and not with any of the others (by themselves).  What if you try one of your Samsung modules in the black slot and one of the others in slot 3 (the orde of population is given in the service manual on p. 40) ?  If your system gets to the BIOS have a look and see what memory is recognised.

Another thing you might try is trying your system with only the on-board video system, but I don't thinjk it is a problem with your video.  Is your BIOS up to date ?  A long search of the HP website will tell you how to check this, and you may download an update from there.  It should also what is different between the different versions of the BIOS. Sometimes the BIOS updates enable different memory configurations.  I would doubt this is a problem in your case because the service manual says that your system can support up to 16GB RAM, dating presumably from when your system was first issued.

Other than some other long shots, I have no further ideas.  Sorry.

Woodwood

16.January.2014 

[turkleton]

Hello,

I have the Envy 700-200z (A10-6700).

I want to identify my expansion options. I have 4 slots which appear to my color-blind eyes to be blue-black-blue-black, populated with one 8GB module, 1600ns IIRC.

1) I understand the limit to be 16GB - is that correct?

2) Can I mix different sizes? (and does the color coding indicate that same-color slots should contain pairs of matched size and speed)?

3) Can I mix different speeds? (Given GPU sharing I would like to eventually increase speed and would buy faster memory even if the existing module limits all memory to 1600 until I replace it)

So for example let's say I find a great deal on a 2x4GB 2200ns kit - would that be usable with the current 1x8GB?

Thanks,

Chris C.

[edit] My search on this model didn't find anything so sorry if questions are redundant...

[Woodwood]

-> Turkleton

Chris,

I assume you have the product the details of which can be found

 here

with one of the 'permitted' configurations (it's a configure-to-order product, right ?)  This being the case;

1) No. The spec document above says the maximum allowed memory (RAM) is 32GB. [ If you are using a 32-bit OS (which you are almost certain not to be), you can only make use of about 3.5GB]

2) In my (limited) experience, all other things being equal you can mix different sizes, though you will lose dual channel except in a limited number of configurations.  The colour coding of the slots (which I think you have seen correctly in this case) does indeed indicate which slots should contain the matched pairs (the DIMMs that make up each pair should, of course be the same speed and size if you want to have dual channel operation: if they were different, they would not form a matched pair, and even they were same, but bought individually, they might not, probably will not, form a matched pair)

3) Experts (and I do not consider myself one) recommend that you do not mix speeds, manufacturers, and even sizes except in the special case of sizes referred to above.  The spec document makes no reference to other speeds being useable, maybe DDR-1333 (PC3-10600) would work, maybe even DDR-1866 (PC3-14900), (but I don't think your system would work at the faster speed, even though your DIMMs were that fast, it depends on your processor and your motherboard capabilities).  I don't know.  If you mix DDR-1333 (PC3-10600) and DDR-1600 (PC3-12800) (if you mix any speeds) your system might or might not even work, even if it works with just DRR-1333 (or just PC3-14900, but I repeat even with PC3-14900 your system is probably limited by m/b and processor, I haven't looked at the specs in too much detail).  What is certain is that if you mix speeds your system will behave at the speed of the lowest, if it works at all.  You can also try mixing manufacturer, but in that case your system would be even less likely to work (at all).

4) see above discussions

If you have a problem with your RAM your PC will most likely beep at you when you start it up.

Your PC should still be in warranty, so I suspect you have free access to proper HP support.  try them, instead of relying on the answers of someone as ignorant as me. (warranty usually lasts for one year and your model was only introduced in November 2013, according the spec document)

Good luck

Woodwood

27.January.2014 

[turkleton]

Thanks Woodwood - great info. With 32GB max I'll try to stick with 8GB modules.

From what I read about the A10 before buying, its GPU benefits significantly from faster memory - but that wasn't an option in HP's config. (It's a configurable model but I took all defaults except the 1x8GB vs. 2x4GB - I wasn't aware of the dual-channel consideration). And I was assuming that faster memory would be supported - I see that I'll have to verify that.

In bygone days we were told to install slowest module in first slot, and the BIOS would cap all modules at that speed, but I haven't kept up with memory technology recently.

Do you have a feel for potential benefit of dual-channel, or a good link to info on it?

I chose the A10 mainly to avoid a discrete video card, so I want to optimize the shared memory as much as I can...

CC

[Woodwood]

->Turkleton.

I believe that the considerations for memory speed are determined by front side bus (FSB) which is determined by your CPU and the motherboard capability.  Often HP  have a link to some more details about the m/b but it does not appear so on this spec page, but I haven't looked closely.  You could try searching the HP website for motherboard info (Jasmine 1) or the MSI number, or try the MSI website.

You probably know more about your computer than I do; if the video memory is shared with the system memory as is often the case with integrated graphics I would guess, then it is reasonable that a certain of extra memory would be beneficial,  I think if it's faster too that helps your graphics; I think memory on graphics cards is often quicker than than main memory.  Perhaps instead of more RAM you should think about a graphics card ?  Again, I don't know.

I'm not sure about the benefits of dual channel operation, I've never come across a good reference, but the wikipedia article explains how it works quite well.  I have a suspicion that any increase in performance you might see depends largely on the nature of the task you are performing.  I shouldn't say anything really because I don't know.  You might try articles in other forums for this

I have read that the speed at which the  memory  operates is solely determined by the slowest DIMM, and your system automatically adjusts to that, but it may be as you say.  However, whereever you put the DIMMs your system must adjust adjust to the slowest, or not use the slower, or not work, unless you are really lucky and the slower memory just happens to keep up. 

As I say, maybe you should talk to HP support, they might just have something useful to say.  The MSI website perhaps is a good alernative, but maybe they don't have info onthis m/b because maybe it was custom for HP ? 

Sorry to have repeated mysef.

Woodwood

27.January.2014

[turkleton]

I set out to get the best overall (non-gaming) performance I could for under $500, and that led me to the A10. With a discrete video card a Core I5 would be better but considerably more expensive and higher power footprint. AMD offers a much better balance between CPU and video. I'm actually very happy with it at that price point. My other desktop is a 16GB Core I7 with 3GB NVidia card, but was more than $1000.

So my goal is just to get the most I can from the system with minimal additional investment. I don't need more memory at this time but if a good deal comes along I want to be prepared to pull the trigger (That's how I got the last 8GB in the Core I7 box, on a $39 Black Friday sale)

Eventually, with more (and hopefully faster) memory, I think the A10 will be able to take over the video editing chores I now do on the Core I7...

Thanks again,

CC

[Edit 28Jan] Tough to find reliable current info on dual channel - some goes back 7-8 years. Also hard to tell if the authors know what they're talking about (except one I ran across who refers to dual channel and double data rate interchangeably). Some say the benefit is substantial, others say negligible...