dv6 supported wifi cards -- BIOS white list update?

[Paul_Tikkanen]

Hi, Gary:

That is good news.

Please post back and let us know if that card works for you.

There is indeed a good chance it will, since you saw it listed in the whitelist and you got one with a HP part number on it.

After all...how many part #'s can HP have for that card?

Although, maybe I shouldn't ask. 

[gkline]

^ Indeed!  Actually, from what I've observed, a specific model WiFi card typically has just one model number.  If there's two, it's because of a subtle difference (sometimes there's a model number that repeats, but one with a suffix indicating another feature provided like Bluetooth capability, assigned a different HP product number).

Anyway, at first I was scared that the AMD equipped dv6's didn't support Bluetooth, because of this entry in the service manual:  "Bluetooth module (for use only with computer models equipped with an Intel processor)."  But in the WiFi card list for AMD, a couple of models were shown with Bluetooth functionality. How could that be?  It then dawned upon me that the Intel based motherboards have a separate socket for a bluetooth module, indpendent of WiFi.  So, the AMD motherboard can provide bluetooth as long as it's included in the functionality of the installed WiFi card.  That's a relief.  

[Paul_Tikkanen]

Yes, folks have to be real careful, and pay attention to what chipsets are referenced when ordering certain parts such as WLAN cards.

The are some Intel based notebooks that use combo WLAN/Bluetooth combo cards, such as the Intel 6250 and others.

And yes, there are some models that have separate BT radios.

I have a HP 6930p business notebook (Intel) and it has the separate BT radio.

However, I have that dv6180us notebook (nVidia chipset, AMD processor), that also has a separate BT radio.

I am thinking that when these models came out (2008), there was no such thing as combo WLAN/BT cards.

[gkline]

This is part of what the problem is with these white lists, because in the area of wireless networking the technological progress is rapid.  The combo WiFi + Bluetooth cards were just in their conception stages back then.

The Elite/business laptops seem to have a better variety of accessories and hardware options. I will have to consider one with my next laptop purchase.

There is something about the HP laptop designs that usually appeals to me above other laptop brands, for the price point. If price was no object, I'd probably go with Lenovo.  HP employs utilitarian assembly designs, making it relatively easy to service them. Keyboards are usually well made and reliable.  Touch pads were touch-and-go for a while (no pun intended), but the latest ones seem rather good. Battery life used to be terrible but has made worthwhile improvements. And having my dv5t for 4.5 years without any problems to speak of is a good testament for HP reliability.  I do know they've had some lemons here and there, such as the earlier dv7 that was notorious for overheating problems.  But again... for the price point, HP laptops are usually a fine choice.  I got my dv6-6145dx used for just $205 shipped and it arrived in nearly new condition.  An equivalent laptop with another brand would have cost 50~100% more.

I expect my WiFi card to arrive in a week or two and I'll be sure to report back on how it works out.

Regards,
~Gary

[gkline]

Paul, I'm rather pleasantly surprised by something that happened today.  HP customer service responded to my e-mail and actually called me.  I wasn't able to answer the phone so it went to voice mail, but I listened to it later.  Turns out it was not a robo-call response.  It was a real person, an articulate representative from HP customer support who ensured me that my e-mail will be elevated to senior management, and an invitation to call back to discuss that matter with an opportunity to provide more details if I wish.

I've never had this kind of reply from a corporation before, so this is rather encouraging.  I'm intending to call them back tomorrow and will report back.

[Paul_Tikkanen]

That is great news, Gary.

I figured if you were polite and articulate when addressing your concerns about the white list, that you would get a response.

Hopefully you will at least get an answer as to why HP does this, and what plans they may have for the future regarding white listing wireless cards.

Let's hope you have a constructive dialog with them.

Best Regards,

Paul

[gkline]

Thanks, Paul.

Yes, I had a talk with one of the representatives for the Notebook product line.  She is more of a customer facing kind of person, who was more about gathering further details on the issue and getting  a better idea of exactly what the complaint is all about.  We had a good 20 minute conversation and she took notes.  The next step is that she will forward this to someone over on the technical side of the team.  I'm definitely not being "passed around", as the first person was the front line defense (determine what complaint is sensible and what's not), the next a front line representative for the product department concerned, and now I'm on my way to be handled by a technical represenatative.

What's great aobut all this so far is that my product is no longer under warranty, yet I'm getting some rather significant "face time" with HP representatives.  It tells me that the organization has intensified their customer concern focus and is willing to investigate customer issues that may be relevant to their greater business interests.  Maybe they're also a bit nervous as the social media channels can be very effective at communicating both likes and dislikes of a brand... and if I've demonstrated myself as a reasonably good communicator, it might behoove them to do what it takes to convert me to satisfaction.

I also communicated with the rep about the solution I'm looking for, which is no more than just a BIOS update.  I would prefer that they remove the white list altogether, so that I can have the freedom to use whatever WiFi card I wish... and as far as HP's concerned, they are only obligated to support WiFi cards that are "authorized" according to the service manual and/or product addendum.  That's the "ultimate" solution for me, but I would settle for a revised white list that includes a number of more capable WiFi cards.  I don't know if that's possible, if the white list has any kind of size limit whereby some other cards would have to be removed from the list to accommodate new ones, or if it can be as long as they wish.

Anyway, I may end up talking with a technical person sometime next week and at that time, I'll probably get the low down on what they can do for me, if anything at all.  I'm eager for that conversation and will report back here on what I learn.

Have a great weekend, Paul.

Best,
~Gary

[Paul_Tikkanen]

Thanks for the update, Gary.

It is very good that they are treating your concerns with care and understanding, and maybe this is the start of something very good.

You have a great weekend too!

Best Regards,

Paul

[gkline]

Hey Paul,

You know what time it is?  It's time to pop open the champagne.  Why?  Well, how about I fill you in on what transpired.

I'd spoken to a very nice representative from the Notebook division at HP.  She's the one I mentioned in my previous posting.  What I hadn't added on was that she called me back later that day, with an offer to send me a replacement WiFi card (at no charge).  This would be the Realtek RTL8191SE (HP part number 640926-001).  She submitted the request that afternoon and on Monday I got confirmation of the item having shipped Fedex overnight.  It arrived today.

I had a little bit of a hassle getting the WiFi card to work initially, because the default WiFi drivers that Windows 7 has in its library weren't compatible.  I had to go back to the previous card, look it up on-line and download the drivers.  It wasn't a simple swap issue though, as the driver software was not easy to locate.  The first pack I'd downloaded ended up not providing the proper driver. And here's where it got a little flakey... as the BIOS was showing the WiFi card identifier as "TX2_RTL8188CE".  It was my understanding that I was sent an RTL8191SE.  And then in the Windows System Info, under the RTL8188CE entry there was a service name showing as RTL8192CE.  Hmmmmm... talk about a schizophrenic piece of hardware.

Anyway, I then downloaded the RTL8188CE driver pack from Realtek after removing the previous HP Realtek drivers, then re-installed the HP Realtek drivers once more.  FINALLY it started working.

The card is extraordinarily better than my previous Ralink RT5390.  My signal strength to the router for the RTL8188CE shows 5 bars most of the time and occasionally drops to 4 bars, whereas the Ralink was normally 3 and sometimes 2.

So... I'm in business with a good solid WiFi connection now.  

HP really stepped up to the plate on this.  The rep I dealt with was attentive, gave me her direct contact info, and was expedient in getting me a replacement WiFi card at no charge.  She has also promised to forward my case to upper management, as I wanted to make it clear that HP needs to address the white list in some other fashion.  Either remove it altogether, provide a bypass for advanced users (in a BIOS setting), or be attentive to providing periodic BIOS updates with newer cards *and* listings in the release notes for the new cards added.  The customer needs to be kept in the loop.

HP makes great hardware and I find it a more cost effective alternative to Lenovo while still providing competitive designs and features/functionality.  It would be a shame to lose customers for something mismanaged as this white list restriction.

Anyway, thanks again for encouraging me to write to HP, as it made all the difference!  If it weren't for you Paul, I'd probably have sold off my laptop and boycotted HP going forward!

Best regards,
~Gary

[Paul_Tikkanen]

Hi, Gary:

That is fantastic customer service, and I am very happy the replacement card works to your satisfaction without having to modify the BIOS.

And you are most welcome for any of the advise I was able to provide to you.

Maybe other folks that may come across this thread, who are also very unhappy with their wireless card situation will contact HP in a respectful, rational manner as you did, and get the same results as you did.

Nobody from HP is going to pay any heed to ranting and juvenile behavior.  Nor will ranting on this forum regarding the wireless card dilemma accomplish anything.

And thank you Gary, for stepping up to the plate, making yourself heard by HP, and providing the outstanding documentation of your efforts in this matter.

Best Regards,

Paul